Jon Gruden -- your thoughts?

John F · 09-12-2007, 06:48 PM

Five years and five years of offensive regression. Five years of QB changes, OL revamps and excuses.

Five years after riding Rod and Monte's defense to the Super Bowl, the Bucs feel like a downright disaster... A coach who won't change non-performing staff members, a GM who bows to his coaches wishes. I'm stacking this post with anti-thoughts but I honestly can't see a positive right now...

lorentrook · 09-12-2007, 11:45 PM

Do you kinda wish the Buc's kept Dungy?

John F · 09-13-2007, 09:48 AM

"Kinda" is insinuating I have slight doubts on the team direction since firing Dungy.

"Do you wish the Bucs had kept Dungy?" seems more spot on. Because I do. I'd rather take consistent teams that get to the playoffs than a team led by an excuse maker. It was Dungy's discipline -- and I've seen this argued time and again -- that got the Bucs the championship ring. Defense drove the 2002 team while slight improvement on offense put them over the top -- by defeating Philly. The Raiders were moot as Gruden was facing a team he had run, that had his former OC calling the shots now. Gruden knew the ins and outs of that team and helped the Bucs pick it apart.

Gruden's best game remains the NFC Championship in Philadelphia where he beat Jim Johnson's playcall.

Right now Monte Kiffin is the only link (in some ways) to the discipline of the Dungy era (coaching wise, not player wise) and he's muted with Jon Gruden's noise machine.

usfbullsfanjordan · 11-27-2007, 09:00 PM

Looks like the offense is beginning to gain consistency, and the team is winning. (7-4) We just need to find a young QB of the future and keep drafting strong. Gradkowski is not that QB but we do have 2 second round picks this year.

John F · 12-03-2007, 04:35 PM

The thing is, Gruden hates non-veteran QB's. Oh,sure, he played Bruce last season and he's played Chris Simms -- but honestly, he has little patience for QB's that aren't ready made.

Not that he won't spend money and draft picks on flavor-of-the-month QB's that come close to his desire of a pre-packaged QB.

John F · 01-26-2008, 01:28 PM

Oh god, the scumbag and his sycophant GM get 3 more years? Ugh. The Glazers are asleep at the wheel.

lorentrook · 02-24-2008, 12:01 AM

He did win you a SB

John F · 03-01-2008, 01:37 PM

^^ six seasons ago. With a team built on Tony Dungy's Character.

Gruden provided an offensive spark. If we just needed that, then hire a new OC. Gruden's offenses don't even rank higher than offenses under Dungy's last two seasons in Tampa. Les Steckel and Clyde Christensen are not Offensive geniuses like Gruden is painted either...

Nat · 03-01-2008, 03:02 PM

lol...I'm with you, John. Dungy has two SB wins under his belt...and alot of non-calls by Gruden (not the officiating boogeyman) kept Raiders from reaching the big game while the latter was coaching them.

John F · 03-01-2008, 04:52 PM

The team seems aimless nwo. Forty Four million under the cap but they are going to throw money at good players they assume are already ready to contribute. Gruden has displayed a lack of patience with those players that need to be coached.

DiamondDave · 03-01-2008, 08:59 PM

I see him as a Billick type... hyped from prior success and an early SB in the early years of the team tenure... BUT never able to duplicate because of very questionable decision making and coaching... TB will not rise again until Chucky is gone

09-12-2007, 06:48 PM	#1 (permalink)
John F Administrator Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Tampa Bay area, Florida Posts: 2,497	Jon Gruden -- your thoughts? Five years and five years of offensive regression. Five years of QB changes, OL revamps and excuses. Five years after riding Rod and Monte's defense to the Super Bowl, the Bucs feel like a downright disaster... A coach who won't change non-performing staff members, a GM who bows to his coaches wishes. I'm stacking this post with anti-thoughts but I honestly can't see a positive right now... __________________ The more they over think the plumbing, the easier to stop up the drain.

09-12-2007, 11:45 PM	#2 (permalink)
lorentrook Moderator Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Sophia,NC Posts: 499	Do you kinda wish the Buc's kept Dungy? __________________ "Never argue with an idiot. I'll drag you down to my level, then I'll beat you with experience." "Those who think they know everything, are very annoying to those of us who do." -Mark Twain http://www.panthercoalition.com/index.php

09-13-2007, 09:48 AM	#3 (permalink)
John F Administrator Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Tampa Bay area, Florida Posts: 2,497	"Kinda" is insinuating I have slight doubts on the team direction since firing Dungy. "Do you wish the Bucs had kept Dungy?" seems more spot on. Because I do. I'd rather take consistent teams that get to the playoffs than a team led by an excuse maker. It was Dungy's discipline -- and I've seen this argued time and again -- that got the Bucs the championship ring. Defense drove the 2002 team while slight improvement on offense put them over the top -- by defeating Philly. The Raiders were moot as Gruden was facing a team he had run, that had his former OC calling the shots now. Gruden knew the ins and outs of that team and helped the Bucs pick it apart. Gruden's best game remains the NFC Championship in Philadelphia where he beat Jim Johnson's playcall. Right now Monte Kiffin is the only link (in some ways) to the discipline of the Dungy era (coaching wise, not player wise) and he's muted with Jon Gruden's noise machine. __________________ The more they over think the plumbing, the easier to stop up the drain.

12-03-2007, 04:35 PM	#5 (permalink)
John F Administrator Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Tampa Bay area, Florida Posts: 2,497	The thing is, Gruden hates non-veteran QB's. Oh,sure, he played Bruce last season and he's played Chris Simms -- but honestly, he has little patience for QB's that aren't ready made. Not that he won't spend money and draft picks on flavor-of-the-month QB's that come close to his desire of a pre-packaged QB. __________________ The more they over think the plumbing, the easier to stop up the drain.

01-26-2008, 01:28 PM	#6 (permalink)
John F Administrator Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Tampa Bay area, Florida Posts: 2,497	Oh god, the scumbag and his sycophant GM get 3 more years? Ugh. The Glazers are asleep at the wheel. __________________ The more they over think the plumbing, the easier to stop up the drain.

11-27-2007, 09:00 PM	#4 (permalink)
usfbullsfanjordan Rookie Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 4	Looks like the offense is beginning to gain consistency, and the team is winning. (7-4) We just need to find a young QB of the future and keep drafting strong. Gradkowski is not that QB but we do have 2 second round picks this year.

02-24-2008, 12:01 AM	#7 (permalink)
lorentrook Moderator Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Sophia,NC Posts: 499	He did win you a SB __________________ "Never argue with an idiot. I'll drag you down to my level, then I'll beat you with experience." "Those who think they know everything, are very annoying to those of us who do." -Mark Twain http://www.panthercoalition.com/index.php

03-01-2008, 01:37 PM	#8 (permalink)
John F Administrator Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Tampa Bay area, Florida Posts: 2,497	^^ six seasons ago. With a team built on Tony Dungy's Character. Gruden provided an offensive spark. If we just needed that, then hire a new OC. Gruden's offenses don't even rank higher than offenses under Dungy's last two seasons in Tampa. Les Steckel and Clyde Christensen are not Offensive geniuses like Gruden is painted either... __________________ The more they over think the plumbing, the easier to stop up the drain. Last edited by John F; 03-01-2008 at 04:53 PM. Reason: manee manee speeling errars :-p

03-01-2008, 03:02 PM	#9 (permalink)
Nat Moderator Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Ohio Posts: 1,177	lol...I'm with you, John. Dungy has two SB wins under his belt...and alot of non-calls by Gruden (not the officiating boogeyman) kept Raiders from reaching the big game while the latter was coaching them.

03-01-2008, 04:52 PM	#10 (permalink)
John F Administrator Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Tampa Bay area, Florida Posts: 2,497	The team seems aimless nwo. Forty Four million under the cap but they are going to throw money at good players they assume are already ready to contribute. Gruden has displayed a lack of patience with those players that need to be coached. __________________ The more they over think the plumbing, the easier to stop up the drain.

03-01-2008, 08:59 PM	#11 (permalink)
DiamondDave Hall of Famer Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: MD, on the Potomac River Posts: 5,390	I see him as a Billick type... hyped from prior success and an early SB in the early years of the team tenure... BUT never able to duplicate because of very questionable decision making and coaching... TB will not rise again until Chucky is gone