NHL attendance down

dkatzism · 11-30-2006, 07:24 PM

I cranked up the old NHL Center Ice tonight to watch the Boston Bruins take on the Tampa Bay Lightning. Sure, it's a weeknight. Sure, the game just started. Sure, this is not a natural rivalry. Sure, Boston is only now reversing its recent trend of being a league lightweight.

But the TD Banknorth Garden is EMPTY! This is an Original Six team in one of the world's great sports towns. And don't even get me started on the Chicago Blackhawks. Even teams that report sellouts (cough, Rangers, cough, Red Wings, cough, Sharks, cough) are flashing some empty seats, especially in view of the television cameras. What about the places like Washington, St. Louis, New Jersey, and Long Island that try their best to hide the thousands of empties they have to deal with on a nightly basis?

What is going on? Is attendance alarmingly low in your building? How do we get TV ratings in the US? Are Bettman and friends in complete denial? If we agree on one thing, it's that hockey is the fastest, most exciting sport in the known universe. So why doesn't it sell? Or why is the NHL so bad at selling it?

Patrick · 11-30-2006, 07:42 PM

The Lightning just ended their 58 game sellout streak a few days ago. But attendance has been good as well as the general following of the team.

Chicago will always draw poorly till Bill Wirtz dies. Blackhawk fans really have no reason to attend till he kicks the bucket and there is an owner who is willing to spend money to win. Till then they are playing for a high draft pick even in October.

I really don't see how Boston isn't drawing, decent team, new coach, signings of Chara and Savard. I don't see any excuse.

LemaireisGOD · 11-30-2006, 08:21 PM

As for my Wild, we sell out EVERY SINGLE GAME; Exhibition, Regular season and playoffs. 18,568 every night at the Xcel Energy Centre. As far as the game your mentioning; I see exactly what you mean. TD Banknorth Garden is a morgue. Many many empty seats but that's been the case much of this season.

As far as Bill Wirtz and the Blackhawks woes...that's only PART of the story. They've spent their money ok...its injuries that have really stung the Blackhawks this season. When this team had Havlat it was VERY VERY good. Havlat and Handzus goes down with an injury; add in some little minor dings to Khabiboulin, Ruutu and this team had a helluva time winning hockey games.

I think Wirtz' TV coverage doesn't help at all, and its still his team whether we or the NHL likes it or not. I look at it this way, its HIS loss. As far as the NHL's problems go. Its simple...with no ESPN there is barely a national presence for the league in the US. As much as the ESPN deal would've been screwing the NHL over its far better exposure than what Versus can provide. I like the Versus' broadcast team; and game broadcasters...but their constant audio/video issues makes their coverage seem like a glorified public access cable channel. Its really too bad because they do provide some decent analysis and insight. Far more in depth than ESPN ever went...but ESPN wins by 1000 times in terms of just giving that added element of SIGNIFICANCE. That's what the NHL has lost...its no longer a SIGNIFICANT part of the American sports market. Its on par with PBA; and ESPN claimed the PBA had better ratings...talk about OUCH eh?

St. Louis is another market that's really suffering right now. The Islanders have played to some pretty empty games at Nassau Veterans Colliseum. Washington as well as Florida have had some pretty bleak nights attendance-wise. Just a few thoughts...GO WILD!!!

dkatzism · 11-30-2006, 10:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LemaireisGOD

As for my Wild, we sell out EVERY SINGLE GAME; Exhibition, Regular season and playoffs.

The Wild sell out every game because they're in Minnesota. (Robbing the State of Hockey of the Northstars was one of the biggest crimes in the history of sports.) I'm sorry, but you could play peewee hockey at Xcel and get 18,000+ spectators.

It was Bettman who felt hockey would work in less traditional markets. And it does, I guess, when the teams are good - Tampa, Carolina, Nashville. But there has to be a better way to make the game more "adhesive," so that the fans will grow with the team and cheer them on even when they hit hard times. I feel this has begun to happen to a certain extent in Carolina, but I can't be sure because the Canes are not horrible by any means.

LemaireisGOD · 11-30-2006, 11:05 PM

We get 18,000+ to watch our State Tournament there...we also sell it out for the WCHA's Frozen 5! We're the State of Hockey...we really feel and KNOW that we are. GO WILD!!!

LemaireisGOD · 12-01-2006, 12:22 PM

Last night...and allegedly somewhat due to the ice storm...the Blues only had 5410 fans last night at their game against the Predators. I watched that game and I HIGHLY DOUBT there was that many. GO WILD!!!

John F · 12-01-2006, 12:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dkatzism

The Wild sell out every game because they're in Minnesota. (Robbing the State of Hockey of the Northstars was one of the biggest crimes in the history of sports.) I'm sorry, but you could play peewee hockey at Xcel and get 18,000+ spectators.

That's like football in Texas. The fact is crowing about Minnesota or attendance in Montreal and Toronto do little to talk about the league as a whole struggling. There are 30 franchises, not 3. Not 6.

LemaireisGOD · 12-01-2006, 01:56 PM

Quote:

That's like football in Texas. The fact is crowing about Minnesota or attendance in Montreal and Toronto do little to talk about the league as a whole struggling. There are 30 franchises, not 3. Not 6.

Oh really? There are 30 teams? Thanks for the revelation. The league is struggling for a few reasons...

1. Lack of true nationwide TV exposure in the U.S. - its bascially regional coverage at best...

2. NHL marketing is only done during NHL games. - Unlike the NFL, NBA or other sports...the NHL only aires commercials DURING NHL games. You might see the odd NHL Centre Ice commercial on cable/dish, but you don't see general NHL ads during primetime TV like you do for the other major sports. The result is...awareness of the product outside of the die hard hockey fans is pretty low and apathetic to say the least.

3. Lockout & Fighting Stigma - Even though we hockey fans are acutely aware fighting is down and the lockout is over, the lack of awareness leads those "outside the loop" of hockey with just old stereotypes. Soccer mom's don't want their kids playing, watching or even thinking about the brutal game of hockey. They see a replay of the Bertuzzi Incident in their minds as they watched it on their local / national news broadcasts and think that's a common occurance in the NHL. Then the other part of this is stigma of the lockout; not so much as were the average sports fans hate hockey now; but rather the average sports fan is barely aware play has resumed. These fans barely noticed the NHL before and the lockout only re-inforced their belief not to care about the NHL even more.

4. Fighting is down - Like it or not, one of the attractions for some fans was the fact the NHL had fights. Some fans supremely just love watching two guys slug it out until their bloody messes on the ice. The crackdown on obstruction has required all players can skate and encourages teams to dress more skilled players and less thugs since most of them could only marginally skate. Some goons have managed to survive but that number is shrinking. Without the fights...some fans may argue the game seems to be more and more like soccer.

5. Versus vs. ESPN - While the quality of the broadcasters, analysis, and maybe even the graphics on Versus has been excellent; the constant broadcasting issues (audio and video difficulties) make it difficult for this network to really promote the league in a way the league really needs. Not to mention many Satelite owners had to PAY EXTRA just to get versus really hurts the exposure level of the sport, ESPN is STANDARD on many basic cable packages. ESPN is the pulse of the average American sports fan whether we hockey fans like that or not. And the average American sports fan doesn't really seem to care if they hear much about hockey; the ratings prove that time after time. A while back, a Dallas Stars fan who works in the TV business said that they virtually had to give away commercial time for NHL games. Why? No corporations wanted to buy commercial times during NHL games because so few watch...and commercials are all about exposing customers to your product/service. NHL games don't attract many viewers; the corporations know that so they don't want to pay much (if at all) to advertise.

Just a thought or three...

dkatzism · 12-01-2006, 02:47 PM

That's why the league is struggling, not any suggestions on how to fix the problems... other than perhaps groveling to ESPN, but I don't see that happening.

LemaireisGOD · 12-01-2006, 06:33 PM

Quote:

So why doesn't it sell? Or why is the NHL so bad at selling it?

This was the question you asked, and I answered it. Although you insist on whining some more.

Quote:

That's why the league is struggling, not any suggestions on how to fix the problems... other than perhaps groveling to ESPN, but I don't see that happening.

I'll answer that question since you apparently lack the creativity to think of solutions yourself.

1. Spend some money and start promoting the NHL during other major sporting events (i.e commercials). Versus should also be involved in this as they plan to benefit too. The commercials should accent the greatest parts of hockey...so that means a gigantic "hell no" to the garbage "warrior" ads the NHL had last year. While non-hockey fans would likely recognize Jonathan Cheechoo or even Sidney Crosby; you could sort of introduce them in the ads that show some of their spectacular skills.

2. Embrace the internet as well as satelite radio. Sirius and XM radio love doing ads; why not have them cross-promote the NHL. They already have NHL stations on there; but only the NFL and MLB have really pushed the fact you can follow the games on these two mediums.

3. Maybe work with NBC to create a "Miracle Night in America" where they play an uninterrupted version of Disney's Miracle. You could then have a post-game sort of show which reflects on the great game with players who were there, NHL'ers who were inspired. NBC now has Al Michaels on their payroll I would think this would be a rather easy event to rig. Once the NFL season ends...perhaps the NHL could try to take advantage of NBC's Football Night in America slot and see what happens with an HOCKEY NIGHT in AMERICA. Yea its a rip off of the popular Canadian program; but why not try to create a culture of being a hockey fan here.

4. Promote the game on the lame Morning programs like Good Morning America and the Today Show. Make hockey seem fun; to perhaps make the hockey mom's want to get their kids get involved in playing the game.

Those are just a few ideas.

dkatzism · 12-01-2006, 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LemaireisGOD

Although you insist on whining some more.

I'll answer that question since you apparently lack the creativity to think of solutions yourself.

Whoa.

LemaireisGOD · 12-01-2006, 08:06 PM

Whoa what...you asked your question and I answered it.

Amberelise · 12-04-2006, 12:27 PM

For the record, there ARE some televised home games this year here in Chicago. I think I read six? All I know is that I've already watched one on tv.

PredDave · 12-04-2006, 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Amberelise

For the record, there ARE some televised home games this year here in Chicago. I think I read six? All I know is that I've already watched one on tv.

That absolutely kills me... I wish Wirtz would get over himself and allow 65 - 70 games a year be televised. In a huge market like Chicago, it could do wonders!

I think more increased fan support would result with more local coverage...

John F · 12-04-2006, 12:53 PM

Six games is still a pittance. The idea that less televised games mean more attend worked in the 1950's and 1960's but with 200+ TV channels now, the Internet and all the other things distracting (potential) fans, you need to make yourself available in every medium possible. Wirtz doesn't grasp that.

The Blackhawks should be one of the marquee franchises of the NHL and instead they are an afterthought. An also-ran.

11-30-2006, 07:24 PM	#1 (permalink)
dkatzism Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: New York, NY Posts: 15	NHL attendance down I cranked up the old NHL Center Ice tonight to watch the Boston Bruins take on the Tampa Bay Lightning. Sure, it's a weeknight. Sure, the game just started. Sure, this is not a natural rivalry. Sure, Boston is only now reversing its recent trend of being a league lightweight. But the TD Banknorth Garden is EMPTY! This is an Original Six team in one of the world's great sports towns. And don't even get me started on the Chicago Blackhawks. Even teams that report sellouts (cough, Rangers, cough, Red Wings, cough, Sharks, cough) are flashing some empty seats, especially in view of the television cameras. What about the places like Washington, St. Louis, New Jersey, and Long Island that try their best to hide the thousands of empties they have to deal with on a nightly basis? What is going on? Is attendance alarmingly low in your building? How do we get TV ratings in the US? Are Bettman and friends in complete denial? If we agree on one thing, it's that hockey is the fastest, most exciting sport in the known universe. So why doesn't it sell? Or why is the NHL so bad at selling it?

11-30-2006, 08:21 PM	#3 (permalink)
LemaireisGOD Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 504	As for my Wild, we sell out EVERY SINGLE GAME; Exhibition, Regular season and playoffs. 18,568 every night at the Xcel Energy Centre. As far as the game your mentioning; I see exactly what you mean. TD Banknorth Garden is a morgue. Many many empty seats but that's been the case much of this season. As far as Bill Wirtz and the Blackhawks woes...that's only PART of the story. They've spent their money ok...its injuries that have really stung the Blackhawks this season. When this team had Havlat it was VERY VERY good. Havlat and Handzus goes down with an injury; add in some little minor dings to Khabiboulin, Ruutu and this team had a helluva time winning hockey games. I think Wirtz' TV coverage doesn't help at all, and its still his team whether we or the NHL likes it or not. I look at it this way, its HIS loss. As far as the NHL's problems go. Its simple...with no ESPN there is barely a national presence for the league in the US. As much as the ESPN deal would've been screwing the NHL over its far better exposure than what Versus can provide. I like the Versus' broadcast team; and game broadcasters...but their constant audio/video issues makes their coverage seem like a glorified public access cable channel. Its really too bad because they do provide some decent analysis and insight. Far more in depth than ESPN ever went...but ESPN wins by 1000 times in terms of just giving that added element of SIGNIFICANCE. That's what the NHL has lost...its no longer a SIGNIFICANT part of the American sports market. Its on par with PBA; and ESPN claimed the PBA had better ratings...talk about OUCH eh? St. Louis is another market that's really suffering right now. The Islanders have played to some pretty empty games at Nassau Veterans Colliseum. Washington as well as Florida have had some pretty bleak nights attendance-wise. Just a few thoughts...GO WILD!!! __________________ "Why mess around with PT Boats when you can have a Destroyer?" ~ Al Strachan (Hockey Night in Canada)

11-30-2006, 11:05 PM	#5 (permalink)
LemaireisGOD Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 504	We get 18,000+ to watch our State Tournament there...we also sell it out for the WCHA's Frozen 5! We're the State of Hockey...we really feel and KNOW that we are. GO WILD!!! __________________ "Why mess around with PT Boats when you can have a Destroyer?" ~ Al Strachan (Hockey Night in Canada)

12-01-2006, 12:22 PM	#6 (permalink)
LemaireisGOD Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 504	Last night...and allegedly somewhat due to the ice storm...the Blues only had 5410 fans last night at their game against the Predators. I watched that game and I HIGHLY DOUBT there was that many. GO WILD!!! __________________ "Why mess around with PT Boats when you can have a Destroyer?" ~ Al Strachan (Hockey Night in Canada)

12-01-2006, 08:06 PM	#12 (permalink)
LemaireisGOD Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 504	Whoa what...you asked your question and I answered it. __________________ "Why mess around with PT Boats when you can have a Destroyer?" ~ Al Strachan (Hockey Night in Canada) Last edited by John F; 12-02-2006 at 03:29 PM. Reason: Edited Message. Quit being disrespectful, LisG. His statement wasn't a personal jab at you.

11-30-2006, 07:42 PM	#2 (permalink)
Patrick Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Florida Posts: 75	The Lightning just ended their 58 game sellout streak a few days ago. But attendance has been good as well as the general following of the team. Chicago will always draw poorly till Bill Wirtz dies. Blackhawk fans really have no reason to attend till he kicks the bucket and there is an owner who is willing to spend money to win. Till then they are playing for a high draft pick even in October. I really don't see how Boston isn't drawing, decent team, new coach, signings of Chara and Savard. I don't see any excuse.

12-01-2006, 02:47 PM	#9 (permalink)
dkatzism Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: New York, NY Posts: 15	That's why the league is struggling, not any suggestions on how to fix the problems... other than perhaps groveling to ESPN, but I don't see that happening.

12-04-2006, 12:27 PM	#13 (permalink)
Amberelise Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 61	For the record, there ARE some televised home games this year here in Chicago. I think I read six? All I know is that I've already watched one on tv.

12-04-2006, 12:53 PM	#15 (permalink)
John F Administrator Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Tampa Bay area, Florida Posts: 2,497	Six games is still a pittance. The idea that less televised games mean more attend worked in the 1950's and 1960's but with 200+ TV channels now, the Internet and all the other things distracting (potential) fans, you need to make yourself available in every medium possible. Wirtz doesn't grasp that. The Blackhawks should be one of the marquee franchises of the NHL and instead they are an afterthought. An also-ran.