Top 5 Football players of all time (Question) - Page 2

LaxD · December 16th, 2006, 11:22 AM

I don't know how people can rank Ladanian so high!!!!

I mean here are the Top backs

Barry Sanders
Walter Payton
Jim Brown
Gale Sayers
Emmitt Smith
Eric Dickerson

I could keep going...

Nyi28nhl · December 16th, 2006, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DiamondDave

Namath... you just lost ALL respect IMHO... the guy is in the HoF strictly because of SB3.... nothing more.. he is one of the WORST QB's to ever be remembered or 'honored'......
50.1% career comp% - CRAP
173TD 220INT (2 years with more TD than INT)

IMHO Namath should be REMOVED from the hall

I agree that Namath is probably the worst QB in the Hall, but I still think he deserves it. It's the Hall of Fame. Usually (including myself) we lose touch of that when thinking of who should go in and who shouldn't. Broadway Joe was an icon, who struck success with his guarentee in SB3. How can you not put him in?

As for the RB arguement:

Faulk averaged 4.2-something
Edgerrin James averages 4.1 YPC
Emmitt Smith averaged 4.2 YPC
Bronko Nagurski averaged less than 50 yards a game, 4.4 YPC
Paul Hornung averaged less than 40 yards a game, 4.2 YPC
Tony Canadeo averaged 4.1 YPC, around 40 yards a game

I had trouble finding the stats for a lot of them (I'm a bit younger, so I haven't heard of some of these guys -- did you use nicknames on some of them?)

Keep in mind also, the more carries one has - the harder it is to maintain a high YPC. Martin played under Paul Hackett's scheme for a chunk of his career. Hackett loved to call third and long draws every time we were in a third and long situation. Defenses caught on, and the play always resulted in less than 3 yards (the poor OL also contributed to that). Under Hackett, Martin was never fully utilized to what he could've been.

EaglesFan · December 16th, 2006, 11:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nyi28nhl

I had trouble finding the stats for a lot of them (I'm a bit younger, so I haven't heard of some of these guys -- did you use nicknames on some of them?)

I believe you'll struggle to find stats for some players from before the 40s. It was part of the reason why I didn't list any of those players. I also thought some of those players made the HOF because of reasons other than their play on the field.

I know Red Grange was dominant at Illinois, but I thought his pro career survived off of his name in college. I also thought Lambeau was in the Hall more because of his coaching than his playing days.

JoeCoolMan24 · December 16th, 2006, 02:28 PM

I have a follow up question.

WHICH IS MORE LIKELY.

That Warren Moon can be considered the #4 BEST QB ever

OR

That Ladainian Tomlinson can be considered the #2 BEST PLAYER ever

Sportycliche · December 16th, 2006, 03:41 PM

we should never use QB stats to justify a QB being a Hall of Famer if he played before 1978 where new rules came into effect to allow the passing game to open up some more (yes there is a reason why pretty much all the leaders for passing yards are from post-1978...)

a Qbs completion percentage? Thank the West Coast Offense and its ilk (Air Coryell and others) Terry Bradshaw completed only 51% of his passes and 212 TDs to 210 INTs. Unitas 54%, Tittle was 55%-212 TDs to 221 INTs.

Top 5 players of all-time?
1. Jerry Rice
2. Jim Brown
3. Lawrence Taylor
4. Don Hutson
5. uh then it gets tricky-I say Unitas...

DiamondDave · December 18th, 2006, 06:47 AM

Don't mention Bradshaw.. he's another I consider a poor choice for the hall. Granted he was part of a team that was dominant, but as an individual, I considered him quite average.

I think we have to take stats in consideration.... but the perception of dominance during the old eras has to be weighed more heavily.... Namath was never considered a dominant QB, and the majority of his limited success was due to one specific receive, not Namath's skills..... while it is a Hall of Fame, fame alone should not dictate... it is a hallowed place IMHO, where excellence should be rewarded, not just 1 game and huge hype from personality....

I love the mention of Hutson.... he was basically Jerry Rice before Jerry Rice... no receiver more dominant in his time

As for the YPC of older players... remember that rules against defensive players at that time were few.... to average high, even with less carries, was a huge feat....

LongtimeBravesFan · December 21st, 2006, 10:10 PM

Suppose Namath had won SBIII playing for the Denver Broncos and all his other stats are the same. He still does his guarnetee, but doesn't become the media icon while playing outside of the New York media spotlight.

Does he still make the Hall of Fame?

DiamondDave · December 22nd, 2006, 06:41 AM

IMHO

No Way In Hell

BMW · February 16th, 2007, 01:18 PM

I'd have to say my top 5 would be

1. Jerry Rice
2. Ronnie Lott
3. Walter Payton
4. Jim Brown
5. Reggie White

To me, you better have some sort of championship, you have to be tough, work hard, and be versatile at your position...WR's block and catch, S tackle and cover, RBs run, catch, block, DE's stuff the run, rush the passer. I had a hard time leaving Lawrence Taylor off this list, he'd easily be 6th.

BravesRule22 · February 16th, 2007, 01:40 PM

Brown, Unitas, LT ( the LB ), Rice and Thorpe

JoseA · February 16th, 2007, 03:28 PM

Walter Payton
Jim Brown
Jerry Rice
Joe Montana
Dick Night Trane Lane

SouthernPitbull · February 17th, 2007, 09:21 AM

top 5 guys no order

barry Sanders
Russ Grimm/Joe Jacoby ( hell, any of the hogs really)
Jim Brown
Lawrence Taylor
Jerry Rice

BMW · February 17th, 2007, 09:24 AM

So I was looking over this thread again, and I was kind of surprised to find that I was the only person to have Ronnie Lott on my list...It's just kind of surprising to me that no one else even mentions him...?

Tomlinson21 · February 17th, 2007, 06:19 PM

Over the period that Tomlinson has plays so far there has never been a RB produce more or be me dominate over a 5 or 6 year period. The guys is awesome, he has just hit his prime in 3 years everyone will say he is that greatest off all time. By the end of his career he will have all the major records. I would put him on any top 5 list you can throw at me.

BMW · February 17th, 2007, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tomlinson21

Over the period that Tomlinson has plays so far there has never been a RB produce more or be me dominate over a 5 or 6 year period. The guys is awesome, he has just hit his prime in 3 years everyone will say he is that greatest off all time. By the end of his career he will have all the major records. I would put him on any top 5 list you can throw at me.

I agree, but I don't think it's right to put anyone who is still playing on a Top 5 All-Time list...let him finish first.

December 16th, 2006, 11:22 AM	#16 (permalink)
LaxD Moderator Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Michigan Posts: 875	I don't know how people can rank Ladanian so high!!!! I mean here are the Top backs Barry Sanders Walter Payton Jim Brown Gale Sayers Emmitt Smith Eric Dickerson I could keep going... Last edited by LaxD; December 16th, 2006 at 11:35 AM.

December 18th, 2006, 06:47 AM	#21 (permalink)
DiamondDave Hall of Famer Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: MD, on the Potomac River Posts: 5,390	Don't mention Bradshaw.. he's another I consider a poor choice for the hall. Granted he was part of a team that was dominant, but as an individual, I considered him quite average. I think we have to take stats in consideration.... but the perception of dominance during the old eras has to be weighed more heavily.... Namath was never considered a dominant QB, and the majority of his limited success was due to one specific receive, not Namath's skills..... while it is a Hall of Fame, fame alone should not dictate... it is a hallowed place IMHO, where excellence should be rewarded, not just 1 game and huge hype from personality.... I love the mention of Hutson.... he was basically Jerry Rice before Jerry Rice... no receiver more dominant in his time As for the YPC of older players... remember that rules against defensive players at that time were few.... to average high, even with less carries, was a huge feat.... __________________ Reagan in 08... Even though he's dead, he's the better choice! Superdelegates - Because even the Democratic party knows it's base is too stupid to make really important decisions.

December 22nd, 2006, 06:41 AM	#23 (permalink)
DiamondDave Hall of Famer Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: MD, on the Potomac River Posts: 5,390	IMHO No Way In Hell __________________ Reagan in 08... Even though he's dead, he's the better choice! Superdelegates - Because even the Democratic party knows it's base is too stupid to make really important decisions.

February 16th, 2007, 01:18 PM	#24 (permalink)
BMW Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Cape Coral Florida Posts: 830	I'd have to say my top 5 would be 1. Jerry Rice 2. Ronnie Lott 3. Walter Payton 4. Jim Brown 5. Reggie White To me, you better have some sort of championship, you have to be tough, work hard, and be versatile at your position...WR's block and catch, S tackle and cover, RBs run, catch, block, DE's stuff the run, rush the passer. I had a hard time leaving Lawrence Taylor off this list, he'd easily be 6th. __________________ BMW Green Bay Packers 14-4

February 16th, 2007, 01:40 PM	#25 (permalink)
BravesRule22 Basketball Community Moderator Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 1,089	Brown, Unitas, LT ( the LB ), Rice and Thorpe __________________ Braves, Knicks, Bucs, Louisville

December 16th, 2006, 02:28 PM	#19 (permalink)
JoeCoolMan24 Banned Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 38	I have a follow up question. WHICH IS MORE LIKELY. That Warren Moon can be considered the #4 BEST QB ever OR That Ladainian Tomlinson can be considered the #2 BEST PLAYER ever

December 16th, 2006, 03:41 PM	#20 (permalink)
Sportycliche Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Carrollton, GA Posts: 143	we should never use QB stats to justify a QB being a Hall of Famer if he played before 1978 where new rules came into effect to allow the passing game to open up some more (yes there is a reason why pretty much all the leaders for passing yards are from post-1978...) a Qbs completion percentage? Thank the West Coast Offense and its ilk (Air Coryell and others) Terry Bradshaw completed only 51% of his passes and 212 TDs to 210 INTs. Unitas 54%, Tittle was 55%-212 TDs to 221 INTs. Top 5 players of all-time? 1. Jerry Rice 2. Jim Brown 3. Lawrence Taylor 4. Don Hutson 5. uh then it gets tricky-I say Unitas...

December 21st, 2006, 10:10 PM	#22 (permalink)
LongtimeBravesFan Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 4,674	Suppose Namath had won SBIII playing for the Denver Broncos and all his other stats are the same. He still does his guarnetee, but doesn't become the media icon while playing outside of the New York media spotlight. Does he still make the Hall of Fame?

February 16th, 2007, 03:28 PM	#26 (permalink)
JoseA Moderator Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: USA Posts: 2,097	Walter Payton Jim Brown Jerry Rice Joe Montana Dick Night Trane Lane __________________ Register here and join the discussion

February 17th, 2007, 09:21 AM	#27 (permalink)
SouthernPitbull Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Orlando, Florida Posts: 114	top 5 guys no order barry Sanders Russ Grimm/Joe Jacoby ( hell, any of the hogs really) Jim Brown Lawrence Taylor Jerry Rice __________________ "The test of success is not what you do when your on top. Success is how high you bounce when you hit bottom." - General George S. Patton, Jr

February 17th, 2007, 09:24 AM	#28 (permalink)
BMW Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Cape Coral Florida Posts: 830	So I was looking over this thread again, and I was kind of surprised to find that I was the only person to have Ronnie Lott on my list...It's just kind of surprising to me that no one else even mentions him...? __________________ BMW Green Bay Packers 14-4

February 17th, 2007, 06:19 PM	#29 (permalink)
Tomlinson21 Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 36	Over the period that Tomlinson has plays so far there has never been a RB produce more or be me dominate over a 5 or 6 year period. The guys is awesome, he has just hit his prime in 3 years everyone will say he is that greatest off all time. By the end of his career he will have all the major records. I would put him on any top 5 list you can throw at me.