random off-topic thread

[indianadrew]

Originally Posted by Heltonfan

And that's a good thing? This is part of the problem... a lot of people think that someone who resembles them would make a good leader. Which is absurd. A leader needs to stand out from the masses, not blend in.

i disagree, heltonfan. a government for the people by the people. there were never meant to be lifelong politicians. we have to disagree on this one. i happen to think that your point is "absurd", and there are probably others on this board who feel the same.

this is an example of the kind of flawed logic that keeps people like ted kennedy going back to washington election after election. before the 2 party system people would serve a term and go back to their everyday lives, wheter that be farming, ranching, or maybe even running a general store

IMHO you should really stick to what you know best... baseball stats, and stop telling people who have a differing opinion than yours that theirs is absurd.

[Heltonfan]

Drew, did I say anything about lifelong politicians, term limits, the 2-party system, etc.? No, I didn't. I happen to think that power corrupts, that term limits are a good idea, and that the 2-party system is a plague on our society. But what on earth does any of that have to do with my claim that the average person has no business holding public office?

[indianadrew]

our founding fathers wanted a government "or the people, by the people". that to me means that the government is a reflection of the people it represents.

i contend that the average person has MORE business being in public office than a "professional" politician.


the framers of the constitution intended for the government to be made up of "average" americans.

[Heltonfan]

If the framers had really intended for the government to be made up of average people, they were complete idiots, because they set up a system that had no chance whatsoever of producing that result (just look at things from the very beginning: our first president was a decorated military hero. Our third president was the guy who wrote the Declaration of Independence. Yep, those are average people, alright. It's not like this is a new phenomenon). And if the framers were complete idiots, why should we hold their ideas up as a guiding light?

The only way to get truly average people running the country is to have them appointed by either random selection or a mathematical equation. If you leave the choice to the people, they'll pick the person they perceive as best, not the person they perceive as the least remarkable.

Look at this practically. The average American doesn't have a college degree, has mediocre people skills, has mediocre critical thinking skills, isn't very comfortable with numbers or with abstract thinking, has very little knowledge of world history and geography... I could go on. Why on earth would you want someone like this running the show when there are millions of people better equipped to handle the responsibility? If you're about to go on a long voyage, who do you want as your captain: the quick-thinking veteran sailor with decades of knowledge and experience, or some random guy who doesn't have any stand-out qualities?

Forget the quaint little notion of "representation". Governing is serious business. Average Joes don't have what it takes.

[Newman]

I agree with Heltonfan on this. The Founders were exceptional people, leaders, not average joes. They actually would be the type to READ presidential daily briefings, unlike the current dunce we have in the White House now.

The problem today is that we have professional politicians like Tancredo and Kennedy. They are owned by special interest groups, lobbyists, and multinational corporations.

We need public financing of elections to remove this problem. This is a solution proposed by the Dems. The Repubs want no part of it. Why? Because they are the lackeys of the transnational corporations. They are bought and paid for and love the money and power.

Look at this recent Mexican trucking deal. The Congress voted 411-3 to stop the Mexican trucks from rolling in America. Bush is ignoring the will of the people, of the Congress, and the Mexican trucks (read CHEAP LABOR) will roll on September 6, if it hasn't already started yet.

Bush and his Repub cronies want to destroy unions, destroy the Teamsters, destroy the American middle class. It's all about cheap labor and unbridled profits for them. How do you spell IMPEACHMENT?

And the thing is all the major Repub candidates in 08 support Bush and his policies. They all support his occupation of Iraq, look the other way on illegal immigration, are all anti union, and so forth. Sigh...the choice in 2008 should be clear.

[John Cocktoston]

Originally Posted by Newman

How do you spell IMPEACHMENT?

C-L-I-N-T-O-N?

I actually hate George W. Bush and didn't vote for him during either election, so there's one thing we agree on Newman.

[Roxpert]

My biggest complaint about the political system in this country is the absolutely irresponsible coverage of issues, and the candidates, by the mainstream media. The superficiality, mischaracterizations, and outright inaccuracies, are appalling.

Yes, we need more than 2 viable parties, and multiple candidates who could WIN in national elections.

Yes, we need more open discourse on the actual issues, and the subtance, rather than the side-shows and trivialities that sometimes overwhelm the discource.

But, most of all, the electorate needs the TRUTH in order to JUDGE which candidate is most suitable for high office. Unfortunately, our corporate media makes that nearly impossible. To see what I mean, please read this new and lengthy Vanity Fair article on Al Gore and the 2000 campaign. The myths and misquotes promoted by the right-wing echo chamber and gladly spread across the corporate media resulted in enough changed votes in Florida to change the outcome of the 2000 election. Our media is a big problem, mainly because there are enough ignorant people who can be fed a load of crap, and they actually believe it. The misquotes of Gore is Exhibit A.

Going After Gore, by Evgenia Peretz: Politics & Power: vanityfair.com

[rockieprogress]

Interesting article.

[Newman]

I so agree with you, Roxpert, about the media being a huge problem. Take Kucinich, my man, for example. Wolf Blitzer of CNN treats him like he's some sort of joke. In these presidential debates, which I've stopped watching, and maybe only political junkies watch anyway, he's displayed as some kind of comic relief by the hosts or ignored, even though he is saying all the right things.

Kucinich doesn't get his name out there because he doesn't have the money in his coffers. With our current system we are stuck with multi millionaires like Mitt Romney as candidates, or ones that are hugely supported by wealthy corporations like, dare I say, Hillary Clinton, who sees nothing wrong with lobbyists. Sigh...

JC, thanks for admitting your disdain for Bush. It makes me feel better. The internet is a funny place. People come on here and get their kicks by yanking the chains of others. Maybe it's a way to release stress or simply have fun. I know I do that from time to time myself.

However, when we're talking about important things, like the country or Bush or the Rockies, I wish we could refrain from that, refrain from the contrarian take just to stir things up. Can't we have a little honesty??

Well, what fun is that? I know...

The honest truth is if it is Mitt vs. Hillary in 2008, we the people won't have a good candidate. I'll vote for Hillary of course, because she's the lesser of two evils, but the Dems have better choices. The Repubs have none.

[BigRapidsJackass]

This is suddenly exploding all over the baseball-related internet.

Read it. It's good. This entry is kind of depressing and heartwarming at the same time.

BaseballAmerica.com: Minors: Non-Prospect Diary: Dirk Hayhurst

[indianadrew]

thanks for posting that link. that story is heartbreaking . it really makes you appreciate what you have.

[rockieprogress]

Wow. I'm speechless.

[BigRapidsJackass]

Does every feel-good story in MLB have an unfortunate twist?

Rocky Mountain News - Denver and Colorado's reliable source for breaking news, sports and entertainment: Rockies & MLB

Cardinals outfielder Rick Ankiel received a 12-month supply of human growth hormone in 2004 from a Florida pharmacy, the New York Daily News reported on its Web site Thursday night.
Ankiel, who was a pitcher earlier in the decade but rebuilt himself as an outfielder. He has nine home runs in 81 at-bats since being called up Aug. 10.

According to records obtained by the Daily News and sources close to the controversy surrounding anti-aging clinics that dispense illegal prescription drugs, Ankiel received eight shipments of HGH from Signature Pharmacy in Orlando, Fla., from January to December 2004, including the brand-name injectable drugs Saizen and Genotropin.

And is it just me, or have the Cards had a disproportionate number of proven/alleged juicers?

[John Cocktoston]

Wasn't someone recently saying that this is their guy?

Breitbart.tv » Presidential Candidate Kucinich Blasts Bush ‘Illegal Occupation’ on Syrian TV

[indianadrew]

Originally Posted by Newman

Kucinich, my man,

that would be newman