Sox shortstop candidates

[Rice4HoF]

Frankly, Beckett better start pitching, because the Sox *had* a SS

So Hanley Ramirez exceeded expectations (or at least reached them quicker than expected), and Beckett had a poor year.

But if you could, would you trade Beckett for Hanley straight up?
NO WAY!

[Zen653]

Assuming we'll only be able to afford one, would you rather "overpay" for Lugo or "overpay" for Drew?

I have zero interest in Lugo. Too much money, too long a contract, not enough talent, and a bad person. Loretta would be half the cost and about 80% the production.

I'm okay with signing J.D Drew as long as it's to complement Manny's bat, not replace it. I do find it odd, though, that Drew will end up making more money than David Ortiz. Ortiz has a bad agent (thank G-d.)

But if you could, would you trade Beckett for Hanley straight up?
NO WAY!

This trade is still too close to call. Beckett definitely struggled but it was his first year in a new league and he still pitched well enough to win 16 games. Anibal Sanchez pitched in a league where Bronson Arroyo is a top 5 pitcher and Hanley Ramirez put up his stats in a particularly weak division. We also wound up with Mike Lowell as a part of the deal, and he was a borderline All-Star during the first half of the season. We'll be in a better position to make a determination on this deal after 2007. I expect Beckett to have a stronger year (ERA in the high 3's or low 4's) and for Lowell to be about the same as last year (maybe not quite as good during the first half, but also not quite as bad during the second half.)

[AutomatedTeller]

Beckett has a ton of talent. He also has a blister problem,which may be aggravated if he throws his curveball. I don;t know that it is, but it may be.

I remember in late august or september, he had his first effective outing in 2 months and all of a sudden, the trainer was looking at his finger.

If Beckett can throw 200 innings with an ERA in the top 10 in the AL, then no, I wouldnt' trade him straight up for Hanley.

He has never done anything like that. And, last year, he allowed the 4th most earned runs in the league.

[Rice4HoF]

Lots of potential, and things that may or may not happen... nobody can predict the future. I remember thinking Len Bias would put the Celtics over the top for the next 10 years and that didn't work out so well (for the Celtics and more unfortunately for Bias and his family).

5 years from now we may look back and see Hanley has become a perennial MVP contender, and Beckett was forced to retire due to injuries. Or Hanley's career progresses like Angel Berroa's, and Beckett has a few Cy Youngs. All trades are risks. Even trades that look great at the time end up being not so good, and vice-versa.

So, I'm not asking who you think is going to become more productive/valuable. We can all argue our cases, but we won't know for sure for a few years.

Just a simple question. If the Marlins offer Hanley straight up for Beckett tomorrow, with no $ changing hands, do you accept that offer?

I will VERY strongly argue that the answer from any rational baseball person is NO! (unless you're a small-market / low payroll team that is trying to reduce payroll - I'm asking specifically about a trade between Boston and Florida carried out in this offseason).

[AutomatedTeller]

I don't know the answer to that. It depends on whether you think that Beckett can be successful and stay healthy.

You could say that is less proven as an ace than Hanley is proven to be a major league SS.

I wouldn't trade Beckett back for Hanley right now, because I think Beckett will figure it out. But if he has another season like 2006...

[Navin Johnson]

How about Khalil Greene from the Padres? Trade Wily Mo for him?

[Rice4HoF]

That would be a great deal. Too bad the Padres would have to agree with it.

[WhosyourPapi????]

A great deal for us???? Greene isn't that good. He hit less then .250 last year and only hit 15 homeruns. His fielding is okay but not great. But then again, he does get walked a lot. That deal would be a pretty fair trade but i dont think the Padres would turn it down.

[Rice4HoF]

You're crazy. And besides, I know where you live, so I can come to your door and knock some sense into you.

[WhosyourPapi????]

Originally Posted by Rice4HoF

You're crazy. And besides, I know where you live, so I can come to your door and knock some sense into you.

Sadly, he's telling the truth

[Lou]

Short stop is on the lower end of priorities in my opinion. A great deal depends on what happens to Manny. With Manny, a good fielder is adequate. If Manny gets traded, a better bat will be needed (like Lugo) to help cover the short fall.

[Zen653]

I just thought this might be a good time to compare what our recent shortstops have done through two months of 2007:

Julio Lugo ($9 million per year): .226 AVG, 3 HR, 33 RBI, .289 OBA, 17 SB, 0 CS, 6 E

Alex Gonzalez ($3.5 million per year): .275 AVG, 11 HR, 26 RBI, .323 OBA, 0 SB, 1 CS, 9 E

Edgar Renteria ($10 million per year): .338 AVG, 7 HR, 28 RBI, .394 OBA, 3 SB, 1 CS, 5 E

Hanley Ramirez ($400k): .314 AVG, 8 HR, 17 RBI, .382 OBA, 16 SB, 4 CS, 10 E

Orlando Cabrera ($8.5 million per year): .318 AVG, 3 HR, 27 RBI, .370 OBA, 6 SB, 0 CS, 3 E

Pokey Reese (retired)

Nomar Garciaparra (1B, $8.5 million per year): .286 AVG, 1 HR, 33 RBI, 335 OBA, 1SB, 1 CS, 3 E

----

As many of us said at the time, I think we missed the boat on Orlando Cabrera. He seemed like a good fit in Boston both as a player and personality. He was a great defensive shortstop who held his own offensively. He's gotten even better in Anaheim. This was easily one of Epstein's three biggest blunders.

We also may have been too impatient with Edgar Renteria. As good as Coco Crisp has been defensively, he doesn't bring anything to the table with the bat. Would we have been better off playing Dave Roberts everyday in CF and holding onto Renteria at SS? Tough to say. Renteria didn't seem like he had the same mental makeup for Boston that Cabrera possessed.

Hanley Ramirez is playing quite well but we picked up a young ace and a pretty good veteran third baseman for him, so I can't complain.

The 11 homeruns for Alex Gonzalez seems very uncharacteristic of him. He's got more dingers than Ortiz and Ramirez. The 9 errors are also atypical. Did he suddenly lose his glove and gain a bat? I don't know what to make of Gonzalez's numbers.

Garciaparra's decision to reject the contract extension with the Red Sox turned out to be a blessing in disguise. He hasn't been much of anything since leaving Boston, and now he's not even a shortstop anymore. He once looked like he'd be a Hall of Famer in the mold of Carl Yazstrezmski. Now I'd be surprised if he gets 20% of the vote.

Given how disappointing Lugo has been with the bat, not to mention the glove, we probably would have been better off with (1) Cabrera, (2) Renteria, or (3) Gonzalez, in that order. Lugo will likely have better numbers than Gonzalez at the end of 2007 but I doubt he'll be $6 million better. Sort of like how I doubt J.D Drew will ever come close to being worth the $14 million per year he'll make through 2011.

It's weird how Epstein pinches pennies with proven stars (trying to unload Ramirez, letting Damon walk, etc.), yet has no problem paying huge bucks to chronic underachievers and question marks. The grass isn't always greener on the other side.