Leo

MikeT · 03-09-2008, 11:18 AM

Leo

McDowell better not slip at all this season.

NadoBrave · 03-09-2008, 12:14 PM

I might be nice, but I just have a feeling his glory days were tied togetrher with the BIG Three's glory days. Sigh......

Snowman · 03-09-2008, 01:39 PM

You know, a few of the O's pitchers (read: the ones who had actual talent) made huge strides under Leo in 2006, and their staff as a whole had an ERA barely over four partway through 2007. Then Jaret Wright, Adam Loewen, Erik Bedard, Chris Ray, Danys Baez, and Jeremy Guthrie all got hurt, and they were all replaced with pitchers who posted ERAs above six (and most of them were between 7.59 and 8.18 ).

TheDeathlessHorsie · 03-09-2008, 01:46 PM

His success was tied to the appearance of exceptional talent who completely bought into his philosophy. There is an incredible book by Roger Kahn, called "The Head Game", which has an entire chapter devoted to Leo. Check it out.

His coaching style, alas is better suited for the 50's or 60's, when It Was Still A Game.

Snowman · 03-09-2008, 06:00 PM

The thing is, "his" philosophy was taught to him by Johnny Sain, who coached more 20-win seasons than any other pitching coach in major league history. And the first thing McDowell did when he took over was to totally tear it all down. No more throwing twice with less effort instead of once with max effort between starts. No more working off of the fastball. No more throwing down and away. Instead, we now throw junk up and in, and when the junk doesn't go where it was meant to go, it's a very hard hit ball, instead of the ball outside the zone that you get when you miss throwing down and away.

I don't care if it's Leo... hell, I don't care if it's Jeb Bush... I just want a pitching coach who will take us back to the Sain/Mazzone method.

jpx7 · 03-09-2008, 07:33 PM

"hell, I don't care if it's Jeb Bush"

As a former Floridian, I do.

(Nonetheless, I agree with you in principle.)

NadoBrave · 03-10-2008, 01:46 PM

I agree with Horsie, the kids today are far less likely to adapt to his "style" & we saw a lot of that towards the end of his tenure when we got younger. I agree with the philosophy as an engineer as well. It won't work well for long if it isn't kept warm (exrecised regularly).

Perfect Cell · 03-17-2008, 10:17 PM

Rehiring Leo would be the best move Frank Dodobrain Wren could make.

Thats why he wont. We got Roger "Im supposed to be good with young pitchers but i suck with them worse than Leo" McDowell instead.

MikeT · 03-17-2008, 10:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Perfect Cell

Rehiring Leo would be the best move Frank Dodobrain Wren could make.

Thats why he wont. We got Roger "Im supposed to be good with young pitchers but i suck with them worse than Leo" McDowell instead.

Amen PC!

bedir than average · 03-17-2008, 10:19 PM

It is notable that the three pitchers that worked the longest on the "throw on two of the off days" system are all still throwing. Sure it could just be them, or it could have been that the system builds better endurance.

pfiggy · 03-17-2008, 10:45 PM

Dodo's are extinct, Wren isn't, therefore a Wren cannot have a Dodo's brain.

Perfect Cell · 03-17-2008, 11:17 PM

Absolutely right. Im sorry pfiggy

Wren doesnt have a brain at all

Snowman · 03-18-2008, 01:11 AM

Well, there's technically no reason one could not have a dodo brain. It would be the rotted, dessicated remains of a brain, but hey... that works for me.

jpx7 · 03-18-2008, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Perfect Cell

Thats why he wont. We got Roger "Im supposed to be good with young pitchers but i suck with them worse than Leo" McDowell instead.

How exactly is that Jo-Jo Reyes project going?

03-09-2008, 11:18 AM	#1 (permalink)
MikeT Moderator Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 1,570	Leo Leo McDowell better not slip at all this season. __________________ You can lead a man to Congress, but you can't make him think. Milton Berle

03-09-2008, 12:14 PM	#2 (permalink)
NadoBrave Veteran Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Fantasy Island Posts: 796	I might be nice, but I just have a feeling his glory days were tied togetrher with the BIG Three's glory days. Sigh...... __________________ *It's a pity ignorance isn't painful!*

03-09-2008, 01:39 PM	#3 (permalink)
Snowman Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: North Topsail Beach, NC Posts: 1,311	You know, a few of the O's pitchers (read: the ones who had actual talent) made huge strides under Leo in 2006, and their staff as a whole had an ERA barely over four partway through 2007. Then Jaret Wright, Adam Loewen, Erik Bedard, Chris Ray, Danys Baez, and Jeremy Guthrie all got hurt, and they were all replaced with pitchers who posted ERAs above six (and most of them were between 7.59 and 8.18 ). __________________ That corpse you planted last year in your garden, Has it begun to sprout? Will it bloom this year? Or has the sudden frost disturbed its bed? If it wasn't for my horse, I wouldn't have spent that year in college.

03-09-2008, 01:46 PM	#4 (permalink)
TheDeathlessHorsie Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Pan-dimensional Transient Posts: 415	His success was tied to the appearance of exceptional talent who completely bought into his philosophy. There is an incredible book by Roger Kahn, called "The Head Game", which has an entire chapter devoted to Leo. Check it out. His coaching style, alas is better suited for the 50's or 60's, when It Was Still A Game. __________________ "If a woman has to choose between catching a fly ball and saving an infant's life, she will choose to save the infant's life without even considering if there are men on base." Last edited by TheDeathlessHorsie; 03-09-2008 at 01:52 PM.

03-09-2008, 06:00 PM	#5 (permalink)
Snowman Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: North Topsail Beach, NC Posts: 1,311	The thing is, "his" philosophy was taught to him by Johnny Sain, who coached more 20-win seasons than any other pitching coach in major league history. And the first thing McDowell did when he took over was to totally tear it all down. No more throwing twice with less effort instead of once with max effort between starts. No more working off of the fastball. No more throwing down and away. Instead, we now throw junk up and in, and when the junk doesn't go where it was meant to go, it's a very hard hit ball, instead of the ball outside the zone that you get when you miss throwing down and away. I don't care if it's Leo... hell, I don't care if it's Jeb Bush... I just want a pitching coach who will take us back to the Sain/Mazzone method. __________________ That corpse you planted last year in your garden, Has it begun to sprout? Will it bloom this year? Or has the sudden frost disturbed its bed? If it wasn't for my horse, I wouldn't have spent that year in college.

03-09-2008, 07:33 PM	#6 (permalink)
jpx7 Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Chicago Posts: 566	"hell, I don't care if it's Jeb Bush" As a former Floridian, I do. (Nonetheless, I agree with you in principle.)

03-10-2008, 01:46 PM	#7 (permalink)
NadoBrave Veteran Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: Fantasy Island Posts: 796	I agree with Horsie, the kids today are far less likely to adapt to his "style" & we saw a lot of that towards the end of his tenure when we got younger. I agree with the philosophy as an engineer as well. It won't work well for long if it isn't kept warm (exrecised regularly). __________________ *It's a pity ignorance isn't painful!*

03-17-2008, 10:17 PM	#8 (permalink)
Perfect Cell Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 215	Rehiring Leo would be the best move Frank Dodobrain Wren could make. Thats why he wont. We got Roger "Im supposed to be good with young pitchers but i suck with them worse than Leo" McDowell instead.

03-17-2008, 10:19 PM	#10 (permalink)
bedir than average Administrator Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Starbucks Posts: 8,256	It is notable that the three pitchers that worked the longest on the "throw on two of the off days" system are all still throwing. Sure it could just be them, or it could have been that the system builds better endurance. __________________ US Men's National Team World Cup Qualifying \| Democracy in Sports Meets My First Campaign "You're only so sure you're right because they're so sure you're wrong." Orson Scott Card in Xenocide

03-17-2008, 10:45 PM	#11 (permalink)
pfiggy Senior Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Location: Location: Posts: 3,665	Dodo's are extinct, Wren isn't, therefore a Wren cannot have a Dodo's brain.

03-17-2008, 11:17 PM	#12 (permalink)
Perfect Cell Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 215	Absolutely right. Im sorry pfiggy Wren doesnt have a brain at all

03-18-2008, 01:11 AM	#13 (permalink)
Snowman Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: North Topsail Beach, NC Posts: 1,311	Well, there's technically no reason one could not have a dodo brain. It would be the rotted, dessicated remains of a brain, but hey... that works for me. __________________ That corpse you planted last year in your garden, Has it begun to sprout? Will it bloom this year? Or has the sudden frost disturbed its bed? If it wasn't for my horse, I wouldn't have spent that year in college.